Are WAGNER’s APOSTLES LEAVING?? – Andrew Strom.

Are WAGNER's APOSTLES LEAVING??
-Andrew Strom.

Last week we published a number of strong statements against
Lakeland by one of Peter Wagner's 'apostles' named Robert
Ricciardelli. For those who are not aware, Peter Wagner heads
up an organization devoted to setting in place "apostles" over the
church. This is known as the 'New Apostolic Reformation' (NAR),
and it has been very controversial. I myself have never seen it as
any kind of true "Reformation" - because all it seems to do is
set up another level of hierarchy over the existing ones. I also
question whether many of the "apostles" are true apostles - but
that is another story. Suffice it to say, that Wagner runs one of
the most powerful and far-reaching global networks in the
Charismatic world.

I don't know if Peter Wagner fully realized what he was doing
when he went down to Lakeland and publicly endorsed Todd
Bentley and the 'revival' there. But clearly he started a rift in his
own movement that may very well almost tear it apart. 

However, before we discuss this further, it is also important to
note that even some "pro-Lakeland" churches are beginning to
have second thoughts about supporting that movement - as more
factual information begins to emerge about what is really going on.

The following was written by the leader of a "pro-Lakeland" church -
and forwarded to me this week. (I have removed the identity of
both the leader and the church). This really is an amazing
admission for such a "pro-Lakeland" leader to make:

"Hi staff,
We need to talk, probably as a staff, and go through what I've
found out. I had a long talk with Robert Ricciardelli. He's no revival
critic... He loves revival, believes in healing, prophecy and all the
rest and is delighted to hear about the healings we've had here.
He's a close friend of Stephen Strader... He's in an accountability
relationship with Lee Grady (editor of Charisma Magazine) and is
a writer for Charisma on occasion. He's part of C. Peter Wagner's
apostolic network, recognized by Peter as an apostle. I've seen
the man's website and he's legit, not a heresy hunter. 

"The reports he has given me are firsthand, not hearsay. I am
deeply troubled, grieved and tormented at what I'm hearing. He
attributes most of the anointing at Lakeland to Roy Fields (worship
leader). I agree. Roy is nothing but clean and God shows up hugely
when he leads worship. I can go into detail later about what is
surfacing, but there are huge lapses of integrity going on... Much
embellishment. Many claims have been made that simply are not
true. The Charisma crew has researched it. I want to weep. My
heart is breaking. For now, to be safe and for the sake of integrity,
we need to stop speaking about the claimed resurrections. Three
of them have been checked out with the doctors and EMTs
involved and found never to have happened at all. Todd has been
confronted with this and has not adjusted the numbers in his
claims. Not a single one of the other claimed resurrections can
be substantiated despite diligent effort to do so. Even after
Stephen Strader brought it down to 13 (and even those couldn't
be substantiated) Todd ran it back up to 27 and more.
Misrepresentation and embellishment!

"On the financial front, Todd recently told the crowd that God had
told him that there were 1,000 people who would give $1,000 and
that they would be blessed 1,000-fold. Robert called Stephen
Strader to confront the unbiblical nature of that appeal. It came
out that Todd admitted he hadn't heard that from God, that it was
just an idea he had so that they could raise money to build a big
stadium. Robert challenged them to issue an apology the following
night based on that false claim of being told by God and they
refused to do it on the excuse that it's a different crowd every night.

"That's the flavor of what I'm finding. There's a lot more. I'm so
grieved I can hardly think. I'm not saying the Lakeland Outpouring
is not of God (God is bigger than the men involved), although good
men whom I have respected all my life are saying just that (that it's
not of God), based on what they know and have seen... 

"What I am saying is that we need to back up and not identify
ourselves closely with Lakeland and that we need to stop repeating
claims being made on the air lest we end up getting splattered
with the collateral damage when certain issues of false claims,
embellishments and lapses of integrity begin to come out more
publicly. By the way, no one is saying that some healings have not
happened - only that many false, embellished or unsubstantiated
claims have been made. A number of really good men, champions
of revival through the years, are actually saying that the whole
thing is of the devil and that even the healings are demonically
inspired. I want to be clear that I'm not going there..." [-end quote]. 

So here we have a 'pro-Lakeland' church checking out these facts
for the first time and now deciding that they "need to back up and
not identify ourselves closely with Lakeland." Pretty amazing!

Meanwhile - back to the topic of "apostles" and what is now
happening in Peter Wagner's main 'ICA' organization:

One of Wagner's apostles, Robert Ricciardelli, put out an email
this week saying that he has received a great deal of support for
his stand against Lakeland - the majority of it from pastors. And
he also made the following very significant statement:

"As a member of ICA, Peter Wagner actually caused many
questions to come my way because of my membership there.
I will no longer be involved with that organization and actually
have not tracked well with them and some of their agendas since
I have been involved with them. However, I have enjoyed the many
relationships I have developed from going to the annual meetings.
Most all of those relationships are also disengaging from their
affiliation with ICA, because of many issues beyond Lakeland." 

So clearly Robert is now leaving the ICA - as are other 'apostles'
that he knows of also. I asked him to clarify this last point.

Robert wrote to me:
"The ICA leadership continues to adopt belief systems without
seeking the advice and counsel of members. Many of the members
do not, and will not support these beliefs, including the support of
anti-biblical behavior and doctrine currently being expressed through
Todd Bentley and Freshfire Ministries. In fact as ICA embraces
this, they now have taken a stance that will indirectly have to
embrace many of the same ministries, including "New Mystic"
John Crowder and others. This escalating focus on angels,
experiences, trances, etc is far from the focus of Jesus, His
Kingdom, and His righteousness... Many of us who really enjoyed
the ICA annual conferences are now forced to make a decision
as to whether to continue our involvement with them."

Robert has also stated that he personally was never into
"Dominionist" beliefs or the "hierarchical NAR agenda." His last
statement to me was: "I think that there is a chance that many
may disassociate with the ICA depending on Todd continuing to
reveal his deceptive doctrine and Peter continuing to support such doctrine."

I wonder if Peter Wagner ever imagined that by endorsing Todd
Bentley he may be sowing huge seeds of destruction in his own
movement? -Perhaps only time will tell.

Send feedback to-  prophetic@revivalschool.com

This topic is being discussed on the Forum at-
http://www.revivalschool.com

FEEL FREE to FORWARD OR POST THIS on BLOGS, etc.

God bless you all.

Andrew Strom.

LEE GRADY on TRUE PROPHETS

J. LEE GRADY on TRUE PROPHETS

My heart cries out for the American church to stop muddling,
muffling, cheapening, distorting and merchandising the pure
gospel. How we need to return to the simplicity of evangelism that
cuts to the heart, produces repentance and reveals the Son of God.

For several months I’ve been asking the Lord to make me his
trumpet. In my quest He’s shown me some of the qualities that
shaped biblical prophets into His mouthpieces. I pray all of us will
adopt these same characteristics.

1. A prophet is bold. True prophets have steel backbones and
foreheads of flint. They do not cower when the majority disagrees
with them. Like the apostle Paul, they are compelled to preach
because a holy restlessness churns inside them. They are
possessed by God, and they must release the fire inside. Will you
pray for this boldness and say with Isaiah, “Here am I, send me”
(Is. 6:8, NASB)—even when you know you will be opposed?

2. A prophet stays biblical. So much of what is passed off as
prophecy today resembles what you might find in a daily
horoscope. The so-called “prophetic movement” in the contemporary
church has been tainted by silly fads and charismatic witchcraft.
One prophetic e-mail list sent out a word recently saying that
dormant angels were being awakened out of the walls of our
churches. (That’s not remotely scriptural.) Another predicted that
God would begin to speak to people through the names of candy
bars and blue jeans.

So much of our prophetic verbiage sounds like warm and fuzzy
fortunetelling. This type of “imitation prophecy” can titillate and
thrill those with itching ears, but it is pablum designed for babies
who don’t want to grow up. What we need is a word we can sink
our teeth into—true meat that is the Word of God.

3. A prophet does not compromise. Nathan was willing to confront
King David’s sin, even though the prophet was on the palace
payroll. Yet today, we practice the “you scratch my back, I’ll
scratch yours” rule. We prophesy what people want to hear so we
can get an honorarium and an invitation to return. This has caused
some whole groups of prophets to collectively follow each other
into a ditch.

Beware of the herd mentality! Don’t just swallow and follow! You
cannot go along with something just because everyone else is
doing it or preaching it. Stay close to the Lord, develop keen
discernment and listen to the nagging voice of your conscience.

4. A prophet is compassionate. Some prophets today refuse to
confront because they are too nice. Others speak rashly “like the
thrusts of a sword” (see Prov. 12:18) and their words are delivered
with a bitter, vindictive spirit. Neither of these prophets will receive
his reward. We must speak the truth, and we must do it in love.

Most people think Jeremiah was angry and judgmental, but
actually he wept when he confronted Israel’s sins. It is not enough
to prophesy the Lord’s word—we should aim to speak with His
tone of voice. We must be willing to intercede for and identify with
those we confront.

5. A prophet stays pure. When Moses made the tabernacle, God
told him to make silver trumpets that were “hammered work” (Num.
10:2). If we want to speak for Him, we must be willing to endure
the smelting process. (In other words, prepare to be hammered!)
Before Isaiah could be an effective prophet to his nation, his lips
had to touch burning coals from God’s altar (see Is. 6:6-8). We
must be willing to visit the uncomfortable furnace of sanctification.

God is not so much interested in the booming voice, the rousing
delivery, the charisma or the technological savvy that we expect
today from celebrity preachers. What matters most is pure content,
and that can only flow through a pure vessel.

6. A prophet faithfully embraces the call. Jonah tried to flee as far
as possible from Nineveh, but the God of the second chance used
a strange vessel to get the prophet back on course. It involved a
visit to a fish’s stomach, where Jonah spent three days in
darkness, stewing in digestive juices. When the fish vomited him
on land, he was better prepared to speak heaven’s words.

~From "Becoming a Trumpet of the Lord" - http://fireinmybones.com

More GREAT QUOTES – Sermonindex.net

More GREAT QUOTES
-Sermonindex.net

"The greatest wisdom on this earth is holiness."
 - W.S. Plumer

"We fear men so much because we fear God so little. One fear
cures another. When man's terror scares you, turn your thoughts
to the wrath of God." - William Gurnall

"Temptations, when we meet them at first, are as the lion that
reared upon Samson; but if we overcome them, the next time we
see them we shall find a nest of honey within them." - John Bunyan

"Making heaven on earth is our business." - William Booth

"If your faith can't be tested, it can't be trusted."

"When filled with holy truth the mind rests." - C.H. Spurgeon

"If we look carefully within ourselves, we shall find that there are
certain limits beyond which we refuse to go in offering ourselves to
God. We hover around these reservations, making believe not to
see them, for fear of self-reproach. The more we shrink from giving
up any such reserved point, the more certain it is that it needs to
be given up. If we were not fast bound by it, we should not make
so many efforts to persuade ourselves that we are free."
- François Fénelon

"Is what you're living for worth Christ's dying for?"
 - Epitaph of Leonard Ravenhill

"One life to live
and soon it will be past.
Only things done for Christ
will ever truly last." - unknown

"Some people complain that God placed thorns on roses, while
others praise him for putting roses among thorns." - unknown

"Actors speak of things imaginary as if they were real, while you
preachers too often speak of things real as if they were imaginary."
 - Thomas Betterton

"Pray hardest when it is hardest to pray." - Charles H. Brent

"Don't be afraid of tomorrow -- God is already there." - unknown

"Your character is who you are when no one but God is watching you."
 - unknown

"The Sunday morning service shows how popular your church is.
The evening services show how popular your pastor is.
Your private prayer time shows you how popular God is!"
- Leonard Ravenhill

"And When I am dying,
how happy I'll be,
If the lamp of my life
has been burned out for Thee."
 - Author Unknown

"The men that will change the colleges and seminaries here
represented are the men that will spend the most time alone with
God. It takes time for the fires to burn. It takes time for God to
draw near and for us to know that He is there. It takes time to
assimilate His truth. You ask me, How much time? I do not know.
I know it means time enough to forget time." - John Mott

"When thou prayest, rather let thy heart be without words, than
thy words without a heart." - John Bunyan

An ICA ‘APOSTLE’ SPEAKS OUT on LAKELAND – Andrew Strom

An ICA 'APOSTLE' SPEAKS OUT on LAKELAND
-Andrew Strom.

[With huge thanks to RevivalSchool member 'SoulDan' for his help].

First, let me start by saying that Robert Ricciardelli has been
incredibly bold and courageous in speaking out on this issue in
recent days. He is one of the very few from NAR circles who have
dared to speak up - firstly on blogs and on the radio - and even on
our own Forum at RevivalSchool.com, etc. Robert is a member -
a "marketplace apostle" in Peter Wagner's "International Coalition
of Apostles" (ICA). He is the real deal. For him to speak out
about Lakeland is a very brave act indeed. Plus he is a Charisma
Magazine writer and a friend of Lee Grady. 

Last week on July 14th Robert was a guest on Radio KGNW -
where he spoke of how he had just come back from Lakeland, and
told of his deep concerns and the background research that he
had been doing. On July 16th he commented on one Internet blog:
"Truth is there are very few people being healed in Lakeland. I
have worked with Charisma Magazine editor Lee Grady in
discovering how many false reports have been released as facts.
These are our brothers and sisters involved in this, but this move
of God has been a move of men with God still touching some
who come to seek Him."

On another blog he wrote: "Charisma reporters and a few others
like myself have tried to get these verified and cannot... We actually
had offered to help, because any news of a resurrection in my
opinion is world news if it can be validated. But then when the
totals continued to mount which led to hype and embellishment,
they began to ask us to stop asking questions. Hmmmm?

"Friday night, Todd said that God said there were 1000 people that
were to give $1000, and they were to receive a 1000 fold blessing.
The one hour drama on this giving subject was so deceptively
evident that it was embarrasing to watch. On top of that, those
that would give that money were able to come to the platform to
be recognized." 

Concerning the 'Resurrections' in Lakeland, Robert wrote: "We
have investigated the 20 plus "raised from the dead" claims as we
want to report them to the media, and they cannot be verified, but
were only called in, or sent in from an email. This is not responsible
reporting, and leaves many questions, which also adds to the
claims of hype and embellishment."  [~Robert Ricciardelli blog
comments - 'jasonclark.ws' & 'stevehickey.wordpress.com']

The hour-long broadcast that Robert did on KGNW is also causing
quite a stir as it does the rounds on the Internet.

On our own Forum at RevivalSchool.com, Robert publicly added
the following comments: 

"Peter Wagner and Chuck Pierce nominated me as a marketplace
apostle 6 years ago. I threw the title away before I ever got it. I am
not into titles, but I am into functions. The Lord told us "yes" to
engage, and He was going to show us some truth in the process.
Being engaged has given us a great oportunity to see the good,
the bad, and the ugly of the apostolic/prophetic movements. The
biggest thing along the way is the friends and associates we have
met that have a biblical worldview much the same as we do... 

"After this year we will pray about next year and so far it looks
like the Father is giving us a sense that we may not to be a part
of the ICA if Peter and the leadership do not reconsider their
impromptu decision to jump into the Lakeland stream, when many
of us warned him not to. It was a mistake to coronate, when they
needed to father and correct Bentley from the direction he is
heading others into. It just put more fuel in his errant tank. 

"I am praying for Todd, because he really is an evangelist, and he
is a gifted evangelist. But he cannot go on embellishing, speaking
untruths, hyping, manipulating, shoving, kicking, slapping, leg
dropping, and bamming his way on the pulpit without consequences.
God will not be mocked, and Todd and others must answer to Him
for everyone led astray. 

"The biggest thing about Lakeland is the lack of the fear of our
Awesome God, lack of repentance and humility. Many have
exchanged the truth for a lie and chosen experience over content.
Angels, trances, and 3rd heaven focus has replaced the gospel
as a focus... Lord do what only you can do to bring your divine
alignment to all of us in Jesus name.." [-end quote] 

I took note of the fact that Robert said that "many" had warned
Peter Wagner not to jump into the Lakeland stream. I also noted
that Robert seemed to be saying that he himself may leave the
ICA over this issue. I thanked him publicly for his courage in
speaking out, and asked him if there really was a lot of disagree-
ment even within Wagner's own movement? 

Robert replied:
"To answer your question, yes there is at least a dozen ICA
members that I know of that are extremely concerned at Peter's
endorsement and more to follow as the nonsense continues. The
transferring of anointing, the focus on man bringing anything but
the gospel is amazing and sad.... if Peter Wagner, Bill Johnson,
and some distinguished members of the Who's Who in Charismania
say it is all good, then people just go with it. Some have begun to
see the YouTube and other information and begun to change.
Some go as far as to claim it as deception, others say it is a
move of God that needs correction. 

"It is my opinion that it was man orchestrated and demonically
influenced from the very beginning. The worship has been good
and Roy Fields is an awesome worship leader, so many in the
worship and even watching from afar can sense God in the worship
of His people. The truth is God has been engaged in the worship
and has touched and healed some. This is why it has been so
confusing to some. I have heard that Roy Fields has stated a few
times that when the worship ends, God's presence leaves the
platform, and then Todd Bentley operates void of His presence.
That is why most all of what they have claimed cannot be verified,
because it just is not happening. 

"We have heard a few people getting well, being touched and so
on. There is a church here in North Carolina that brought 27 sick
down there for a week. Some with cancer, leukemia, diabetes
and such. None got healed and most were worse when they
came back. The emperor is not wearing any clothes and the truth
must be known. Many are claiming that Todd is the new thing
that God is doing. The fact is he is still operating in the old thing,
and operating with less integrity and character than the previous
one man shows. 

"God is about nameless and faceless people who are operating
without any agenda but the Lord's. Preaching about the King
and His Kingdom, and moving supernaturally after Him, and as
they do, signs and wonders follow. The problem in Charismania
is that they seek the sign, they seek the thrill, they seek the
craft supply quality gold dust, feathers and gems. They may get
the chills and frills, but leave with nothing more than goose bumps
and really little spiritual change. When they seek the King, the
Kingdom of God and His righteousness, you begin to see
transformation take place at the heart level. This is God's way
and always has been... Bentley is just a product of the Charismatic/
apostolic/ prophetic trending away from Plumb line truth. At the
same time the fact is, none of us amount to much, no not one.
But in Him and dying to self and living His agenda, we can move
mountains... The church is getting there, I wrote an article for
Charisma that everything that can be shaken is being shaken,
and this is what is happening in a great way right now..." [end quote]

Friends, please write to Robert encouraging him if you can for
the courageous stand he is taking.

See more of his comments + links to his article & radio show
on the 'Scrolling Forum' at the following website (main page) -

http://www.revivalschool.com

PLEASE FORWARD This EMAIL TO OTHERS.

God bless you all,

Andrew Strom.

DELAYS Are NOT DENIALS – Unknown

DELAYS Are NOT DENIALS
-Unknown.

How often have we been tempted to give up on God, on prayer, on
waiting, on patience and endurance, because God delayed in
answering prayer immediately? How many parents, after praying
for decades, have still not seen the salvation of a child? How many
believers have prayed night and day for healing, but still suffer or
have to behold the suffering of a loved-one? Not a few have prayed
and fasted for their financial needs to be met, and have agonized
because of mounting debt? BUT GOD…was in full control and had
a reason for the delay, for delays are not denials. We must keep
the bow string taut and continue to pray, for only God knows how
close to the crest of the hill we are. We must not give up despite
disappointments, for God will justify Himself and bring glory to
Himself. That great man of faith, Elijah, not only prayed to God for
rain. He also kept gazing toward the horizon for the tell-tale signs
of a cloud, until eventually a cloud the size of a man’s fist
appeared. He persevered until the heavens unleashed its glory,
and God’s word was fulfilled.

George H. Morrison in “Devotional Sermons” has given hope to the
weary. Read on, dear saint, and be reassured that “as soon as
you began to make your request, a reply was sent. I have come to
give you the reply…” (“You had no sooner started your prayer
when the answer was given” – Msg) – Daniel 9:23.

{Please don’t give up on the quality of speech in this devotional.
You might learn from it the treasures of the English language.}

The Doctrine of Delays

….There are myriads of creatures who are born and dance and die
in the short span of a bright July day. No one in watching them
would ever dream of charging the Creator with delay. But a nation
of men which is to serve the high ends of heaven is never fashioned
hastily like that. Through pilgrimage and war and struggle and
blood and tears, by heroism that oft seems unavailing and sacrifice
that is like water spilt, it becomes the polished instrument of God.
Delay, then, tends to become more marked, the higher you rise in
the Creator’s purposes. Great delays in the mystery of providence
are the highway for the chariot of great blessing. The joy that
cometh in the morning might be far less thrilling, had not the
weeping from which it springs endured all night.

Had Jesus forgotten Mary and Martha? We see this very clearly in
the raising of Lazarus—that tenderest and most touching of all
miracles. When Lazarus was ill – when his state had become critical -
Martha and Mary, you remember, sent word to Jesus. Now Jesus
loved Lazarus and his sisters, and the happiest memories
encircled that village home; yet the Gospel tells us that when
Jesus heard the news, He abode two days still in the place where
He was. There are seasons when two days seems like a moment;
there are seasons when two days seems an eternity. When a life
is in the balance half-an-hour is endless; twice four-and-twenty
hours is unbearable. What did it mean? Had Jesus quite forgotten
them? Was He deaf and dead to the prayers of the sisters’ love? I
think that Martha and Mary, with their eyes on dying Lazarus,
knew the burden of divine delay. They knew its burden then; they
know its meaning now. They see it irradiated with purpose and
with wisdom. A little boon might have been granted instantly, but
the great actions of God have tardy wheels. The greater and richer
the blessing that we pray for, the more must we reckon on the
delays of God. Nor should we forget—for this is very important—
what I might call the moral training of delay. Did we get everything
we craved for in the very hour of asking it, I think it would be a long
farewell to manhood. The one sure way to ruin a young child is to
give it immediately all for which it asks; and to the Ancient of days,
whose hairs are white as wool (see Dan_7:9), I fancy the oldest
readers are but as little children.

Think of Christ’s treatment of the Syro-phoenician woman when
she came to Him praying for her daughter. All her motherhood was
on her lips and in her eyes as she pled and interceded for her child.
Do you think it was cruel of Christ to answer her never a word?
Do you think it was harsh to speak about the dogs? How much
we should have missed, and how much Christ Himself would have
missed, had it not been for that practice of delay! It was that which
called out in her fine persistence, her faith, her wit, all that was
brightest in her. She might have been anybody when she began,
but she was a woman among women when she ended. And many
a person has begun by being anybody, and ended by being a
woman among women, because they were kept praying and
pleading long for something that was to be granted by and by.

Work reveals character, but so does waiting. Waiting shows the
baby or the man. We need to be tested to prove if we be worthy
just to receive and use the thing we crave. So it often is that God
delays, and will not answer us, and keeps us waiting. It is not in
scorn, but in the wisest love, that He will not for a while.

There Is Silent Preparation behind God’s Delay

Then it is very helpful to remember that divine delay does not mean
inactivity. God is not idle when He does not answer us; He is
busier preparing the answer than we think. There have been men
of genius who could only work irregularly; for long periods they
seemed to do nothing at all. Then suddenly, and as if by inspiration,
their powers took fire and they wrought at a white heat. You may
be sure of it that the periods in between were not so idle as the
world considered them. By thought, by reading, by communion
with glad nature, half unconsciously they were preparing for their
work. And when the kindling came, and the fire burned within them,
when they were divinely swept into utterance or action, they owed
far more than we should ever guess to the silent preparation of
delay. As it is with men of genius, so with God, only in loftier and
nobler ways. His delays are not the delays of inactivity. They are
the delays of preparation. In an instant the tropical storm may
burst and break, yet for weeks—unseen—the storm has been
preparing. The sunshine of May comes, and all the world is green,
yet on God’s loom of January that robe was being spun. And the
morning breaks when at last some prayer is answered, and the
desert rejoices and blossoms as the rose, yet the answer was
being fashioned in these very years when we said there was no
eye to pity and no arm to save.

It takes a million years to harden the ruby, says the poet, yet
through all the years the hardening goes on. It takes a century
for the sea to wear away one cliff, yet every night when we sleep
the breakers dash on it. So when we pray and strive and nothing
happens, till we are tempted to say “God does not know, God
does not care,” who can tell but that, behind the veil, infinite love
may be toiling like the sea, to give us in the full time our heart’s
desire?

“My Father worketh hitherto and I work.” It is a mysterious word
of the Lord Jesus Christ. Perhaps God, like some of the busiest
men I know, is doing most when He seems to be doing nothing.
There Is Love in Delay And so in closing I would say to you: do
not lose heart at the delays of God. Speed, after all, is but a
relative term, and there is more love in God’s slow method than
you think. I was staying the other week with some friends in
Ireland, when word came that our friend’s place of business had
been broken into. It was a holiday and he was away in Galway,
and was not to be home again until that evening. Well, he came
home, very tired and famished, and a foolish wife would have
rushed out to meet him with the news; but his wife was not foolish,
she was Scotch and sensible, and she let him wash and eat and
rest himself a little; and then when he was ready to see things
rightly she broke the news, and I saw there was wisdom and love
in that delay.

You who are mothers here, and who look back on those sweet
years when your innocent children played about your feet, had you
never some great news to tell your children, yet you deliberately
withheld it for a time? “If we tell them tonight there will not be one
wink of sleep; if we tell them when they waken, there will not be
one bite of breakfast”; and so deliberately you held back the
blessing, and you did it just because you loved them so. If ye
then being evil, act like that, is it incredible that God should do
the same? Is it fair to distrust our Father, to say He has no pity,
to charge the heavens with being brass above us? I think it is
wiser to pray on, strive on, casting all doubts to the devil who
inspired them; believing in a love that never mocks us, and that
will give us our heart’s desire in His own time.

“AN INSIDER’s WARNING” – Lakeland Revival

PLEASE WATCH Our YOUTUBE VIDEOS 

"AN INSIDER's WARNING" - Lakeland Revival

Ian Mander from Video Foundry has done a great job putting
these videos together in a hurry. There are 5 parts - totalling
about 35 mins. The series is called "AN INSIDER's WARNING".
Please give comments and ratings and also post them on blogs,
etc, if you can, my friends? -This will be a huge help.

Pt. 1 - 
Pt. 2 - 
Pt. 3 - 
Pt. 4 - 
Pt. 5 - 

Thankyou so much and God bless you all!

Great RAVENHILL QUOTES – Leonard Ravenhill

Great RAVENHILL QUOTES
-Leonard Ravenhill.

“A popular evangelist reaches your emotions. A true prophet
reaches your conscience.”

“The last words of Jesus to the church (in Revelation) were ‘Repent!’”

“A true shepherd leads the way. He does not merely point the way.”

“Your doctrine can be as straight as a gun barrel—and just as empty!”

“John the Baptist never performed any miracles. Yet, he was greater
than any of the Old Testament prophets.”

“I doubt that more than two percent of professing Christians in the
United States are truly born again.”

“Our God is a consuming fire. He consumes pride, lust, materialism,
and other sin.”

“There are only two kinds of persons: those dead in sin and those dead to sin.”

[Concerning the darkness that has enveloped most of Christendom:]
“When you’re sitting in a dark room, you can either sit and curse the
darkness—or you can light a candle.”

“Children can tell you what Channel 7 says, but not what Matthew 7 says.”

“Some women will spend thirty minutes to an hour preparing for
church externally (putting on special clothes and makeup, etc.).
What would happen if we all spent the same amount of time
preparing internally for church—with prayer and meditation?”

“Maturity comes from obedience, not necessarily from age.”

“What good does it do to speak in tongues on Sunday if you have
been using your tongue during the week to curse and gossip?”

“The only time you can really say that ‘Christ is all I need,’ is when
Christ is all you have.”

“The Bible is either absolute, or it’s obsolete.”

“Why do we expect to be better treated in this world than Jesus was?”

“Today’s church wants to be raptured from responsibility.”

“Testimonies are wonderful. But, so often our lives don’t fit our testimonies.”

[Concerning one of the new “movements” in the church that was
causing a stir among Christians:] “There’s also a stir when the
circus comes to town.”

“My main ambition in life is to be on the Devil’s most wanted list.”

“You can’t develop character by reading books. You develop it from conflict.”

“When there’s something in the Bible that churches don’t like,
they call it ‘legalism.’”

“We can’t serve God by proxy.”

“We must do what we can do for God, before He will give us the
power to do what we can’t do.”

“There’s a difference between changing your opinion, and changing
your lifestyle.”

“Our seminaries today are turning out dead men.”

“How can you pull down strongholds of Satan if you don’t even have
the strength to turn off your TV?”

“Everyone recognizes that Stephen was Spirit-filled when he was
performing wonders. Yet, he was just as Spirit-filled when he was
being stoned to death.”

“If a Christian is not having tribulation in the world, there’s
something wrong!”

[Concerning the fixation that today’s church has with numbers,
with growth at any price:] “The church has paid a terrible price for
statistics!”

“Any method of evangelism will work—if God is in it.”

“Church unity comes from corporate humility.”

“You can have all of your doctrines right—yet still not have the
presence of God.”

“Many pastors criticize me for taking the Gospel so seriously. But
do they really think that on Judgment Day, Christ will chastise me,
saying, ‘Leonard, you took Me too seriously’?”

“If Jesus had preached the same message that ministers preach
today, He would never have been crucified.”

“You can know a lot about the atonement, and yet receive no benefit from it.”

“If the whole church goes off into deception, that will in no way
excuse us for not following Christ.”

RAVENHILL's MOST POWERFUL BOOK - "Why Revival Tarries".

~SOURCE - http://www.scrollpublishing.com/store/Ravenhill.html

A CHRISTIAN CIVIL WAR?? – Andrew Strom

A CHRISTIAN CIVIL WAR??
-Andrew Strom.

This week the editor of Charisma Magazine, Lee Grady, published
an article on a topic that I have very much been wanting to comment
on myself for some time. His article is called "Can We Avoid a
Charismatic Civil War?" Below are some large extracts from the
article - with my comments at the end. Friends, this is a topic that
truly concerns us all:

Lee Grady writes:
"Some leaders say the controversial Lakeland Revival is forcing us
to choose sides. But I don't believe God wants to split our movement.

"It's been more than 10 years since charismatic prophet Rick Joyner
predicted in his popular book The Final Quest that believers would
experience a Civil War in the church. Joyner's book, based on a
series of visions he says God showed him, describes in graphic
detail a turbulent conflict that redefines Christianity as we know it.

"Other charismatic leaders have echoed this theme since Joyner's
book was published in 1996. They have predicted that our move-
ment will be divided between "Blues" (those who constantly live
in the supernatural realm of dreams, visions and miracles) and
"Grays" (those who rely more on their intellect), and that the Blues
will win and usher in true revival as champions of the Holy Spirit's power.

"Even in early 2008, before the Lakeland Revival erupted in Florida
in April, some charismatic prophets were declaring that a great
rift would divide those who believe in "the glory realm" and those
who have a more conservative, left-brained approach to their faith.
When God TV began its nightly broadcasts of evangelist Todd
Bentley's healing meetings in Lakeland, the Civil War prophecies
reappeared overnight on hundreds of blogs and e-mail blasts.

"I'll admit I was not paying too much attention to these Civil War
predictions 10 years ago. But I was jolted into reality in May after
I wrote an online column in which I raised honest questions about
some of Bentley's teachings and techniques. Even though I
celebrated his passion and zeal, and praised God for the healings
that were reported in Lakeland, I was immediately branded a revival
critic and banished to the Gray camp.

"I became the bad guy because, by asking questions, I was
'relying on my intellect.' To those in the Blue camp, my skepticism
made me an enemy of the Holy Spirit and all things supernatural -
even though I believe that all the supernatural gifts of the Holy
Spirit are for today!

"I tried to laugh this off at first. Surely, I imagined, my Christian
brothers and sisters do not really think it is wrong for a Spirit-filled
believer to test the spirits (which we are instructed to do in 1 John
4:1), discern truth (see 2 Pet. 3:17) or evaluate prophecies and
angelic encounters (see 1 Cor. 14:29, Gal. 1:6-8).

"But now I realize that some people really want a war. They want
the charismatic movement to split right down the middle. They
imply that all those who do not embrace 100 percent of the current
movement in Lakeland are "old wineskins" that cannot be used by
God in the coming revival.

"I can't even describe how much this hurts because I love people
on both sides of this conflict. I love the Blues and the Grays, along
with every other color in the body of Christ. I refuse to believe that
God is trying to split us. Division is the devil's work.

"I want to plead with everyone in our movement to reconsider the
whole Civil War scenario. Instead of rattling sabers and stockpiling
gunpowder, maybe we need to take steps in the opposite direction:

1. Let's accept one another... 

2. Let's admonish one another....
[B]ecause I embrace Todd Bentley as my brother in Christ, I must
take a higher road even if I don't agree with his prayer methods or
his claims regarding angels. Anything I say, even if it is corrective,
must be said in love (see Eph. 4:15).

3. Let's pray for one another (see James 5:16). Jesus prayed that
we would be one. There is no record of Him praying that we would
split over doctrine. So why in the world would any of us hope for
a Civil War?

"Please pray for Bentley - and for the leaders who are speaking
into his life during this season. And pray that the church will not
only experience genuine spiritual revival but also true unity. Let's
work out our differences, support one another's ministries and
focus all our efforts on one common goal: To tell a lost world about
the love of Jesus."  [~Source: www.fireinmybones.com]

Andrew Strom replies:
I am just as strongly against a "Christian Civil War" as Lee Grady,
but there are certain things in his approach that I just cannot
agree with. Back in 1996, when Rick Joyner came out with his
Civil War prophecy I even wrote an article on it entitled "WHY I
OPPOSE the CIVIL WAR". (-A pretty outdated article now, but I
am just as opposed today as I was then). I have never believed
in such a thing - especially when it was essentially a call for the
Prophetic/Toronto camp to try and "drive out" those who oppose
them - right out of the church. It always seemed an utterly ill-
advised and disastrous course to me - to put out a call like that
just because people are opposing or questioning the "manifestations"
that you are involved with. Is that any excuse for trying to "drive"
them out? -I felt quite sad and shocked by it.

But Lee is right. There is a lot of "aggression" around right now -
and it always happens when these kinds of movements come
along. People get aggressive and nasty on both sides. I noticed
it with Toronto and I am noticing it now. Suddenly everyone wants
to "bash" each other. They want to make it "personal". I am not
into this either - not at all.

There is nothing wrong with asking questions or "testing the
spirits". In fact we are COMMANDED to do this in Scripture - "for
many false prophets are gone out into the world." (ie. Because
they did not 'test' the spirits - 1 John 4:1). But I believe we can
do this without becoming harsh or demeaning or 'personal' about
it. We can simply bring out the facts and let them speak for
themselves. We don't have to get "nasty" at all. This is one of the
biggest problems I have with the 'heresy hunters' that are all over
the Internet. There is often such a harsh, sarcastic, "personal"
tone to much that they write - and they seem almost eager to
dredge up every little piece of "dirt" that they can. It becomes
literally a "mud-slinging" contest - harsh and ugly - without any
of the fruit of the Spirit demonstrated at all.

Do I want to be attacking Lakeland or Todd Bentley in that way?
No - I want no part of it at all. I believe we can raise the issues
and bring forth the facts and "test the spirits" without resorting to
any of these tactics. And our battle is not with flesh and blood
anyway - it is with spiritual deception in "high places". So I am
not at "war" with Todd Bentley. I will be as polite and reasonable
as I can - while still putting forth the TRUTH about what I regard
as dangerous heresy.

And here is where Lee Grady and I begin to differ. You see, in the
Bible, heresy and deception and "seducing spirits" were always
treated as deeply serious and horrific things. With serious deception
it was never a case of being "lovey-dovey" or making mild 'back-
room' corrections. You will notice that in Scripture they always
corrected large-scale public deception IN PUBLIC. Sometimes
Paul would even name names in public - or issue public rebukes.
If there was a private offense or a personal issue between brothers -
that was different. If at all possible, you deal with personal offense
privately. (Matt 18). But when there is large-scale deception that is
spreading, you have to speak out boldly, publicly and strongly -
because the health of the entire body is at stake. This is clearly
what we see in Scripture. And "lovey-dovey-ness" was out the
window! Paul and the apostles and Jesus Himself were very strong
in publicly rebuking these kinds of people and their practices -
whether they were believers or not. They did it for the health of the
whole Body.

Sadly I get the feeling that Lee Grady may be whimping out a
little bit on some of this. It sounds so loving and "tolerant" to
speak of unity and say things like 'Can't we all just get along?"
But this is not true biblical unity - which is based on TRUTH.

The fact is, Jesus said, "I have come not to bring peace but a
sword." There is sometimes a division or separating that occurs
over major issues which is unavoidable - and in fact can be totally
necessary. There are some things that God does not WANT
connected with His body! A separation is not always bad. It
happened with Jesus all the time. He came to bring a "sword"
after all - and He promised that such things would happen.

So I can well believe that there may come some kind of separation
in the Charismatic movement. But let it not be because we
ourselves are trying to "drive" people out or slinging mud - or
engaging people in ways that are harsh or bitter. Let us preach
the truth in love, and if there is to be a separation, let God Himself
bring it about - not us through strife or bitter contention. My friends,
there is a way to conduct ourselves in these things that should
speak volumes to all - even the opposers. Let the spirit in which
we do things be truly godly. Amen?

This issue is being discussed at-
http://www.revivalschool.com

God bless you all.

Andrew Strom.

MAN CHANGES MIND on LAKELAND

"I'VE CHANGED my MIND ABOUT LAKELAND"
- Ken [-Revivalschool member].

Well, shortly after Lakeland started I was posting here as a
"supporter". I had my life transformed in the Brownsville revival,
and knowing that many who were offended at Lakeland were from
the same camp as those who opposed Brownsville, I naturally took
what I thought to be "the proper side". Although I did say I was put
off by the hype surrounding Lakeland, I was open to the idea that it
was "from God", and I saw criticism from this board that I chalked
up to mostly phariseeism. 

Then a couple of weeks ago I saw this video on YouTube. [-Linked
below]. It changed my mind once and for all. I don't know what
spirit was speaking to Bentley when he was told the revival wasn't
about getting people to Jesus, but it's about getting people to
believe in "the angel", but I've enough discernment to know it
wasn't God's Spirit! 

This should be elementary, but since sharing this with others I
know who've supported Lakeland, I was shocked to find it really
didn't bother them in the least! The leader of the revival says it's
not about getting people to Jesus but getting them to believe in
"the angel"- SINGULAR. What the heck? Is this the delusion? 

Well, I've seen the devil tip his hand and I've turned the other
direction. If God allowed me to see it and turn, He'll show others
too. I'm praying it happens, and I'm telling everyone I know about this. 

I apologise to anybody I might have offended or misled in keeping
my "open mind" about Lakeland. I would exhort everyone who still
thinks this is "from God" to honestly listen to what's being said on
the video. Does the Holy Spirit lead people to Jesus, or angels?  

LINK to VIDEO -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKA_X1zxOQc
 -------------
MORE from KEN:
Todd said that "God" told him "Todd, you've got to get the people
to believe in the angel." I don't know how else to take that. I don't
have a problem with believing in the supernatural, if I didn't believe
in the supernatural I wouldn't believe in Jesus in the first place! 

But look at the statement again. It looks like an agenda to me.
Todd and the rest (Bob Jones, etc.) are always talking about their
encounters with supernatural entities, but you never once hear
how they test what they're supposedly communicating with. I've
even heard BJ say that he told a "priest" that was talking to him, "I
know that you're Jesus, but I don't know who". 

So who, or what are these spirits that are talking to these guys?
They aren't tested, and nobody from the prophetic movement
seems to think it's important that they are. The "credentials" of the
preacher passing on the message are good enough (Credentials
meaning, how many people do they have following their ministry).
Well, that's not the criteria I read in the Bible for testing the spirits.....

So my point is, the spirits aren't tested, so all you have to go by is
does what they say agree with the Spirit and the Word? Would it
be on God's agenda to get people to believe in "The angel" ? Why?
Was that a running theme in the New Testament church? Was
Paul bent on getting the "gospel of the angel" to the church at
large, or to any of his mission field? I have to say no, it is and
always has been and never will be anything other than getting the
people to JESUS. If things aren't going "that direction", count me
out - I ain't goin', and I'll tell anyone else who'll listen they should
skip the trip, too... 

In the context of that message Todd was talking about "the angel
of the winds of change", who Todd says is responsible for the revival.
Why is an angel responsible for the revival? Why wouldn't God
Himself be responsible? What angelic entity that was of the host
of the Lord would even allow a "move of God" to focus on itself? I
can think of only one type of angel that would receive any kind of
special attention or glory from men - that would be a fallen angel. 

Let the Spirit of the Lord speak to your heart concerning these things. 

I pray you find the true God and Lord of the Bible and follow Him only. 

~Read more discussion of this topic on the Forum at-
http://www.revivalschool.com

ANDREW’s NEW BOOK on FLORIDA REVIVAL – now available!

ANDREW STROM's NEW BOOK - for *Any* Donation- 

"TRUE & FALSE REVIVAL"  (124 pages).

What are the FACTS about Todd Bentley's Lakeland revival that
we are not hearing? What is really behind the strong emphasis
on getting 'drunk' and strange angel encounters, etc? What is
happening around the world as this 'anointing' hits other places?
Why does the New Age "Kundalini" experience seem almost
identical to this 'impartation'? What is True Revival, and how do
we tell the false from the true? -All these questions and more
are answered in this provocative book.

(The author, Andrew Strom, spent 11 years in the same Prophetic
movement as Todd Bentley - until he quit in anguish over the
unbiblical and bizarre things going on in that movement. Thus he
brings a real "Insider's" perspective to this subject).

IMPORTANT NOTE:  This book supercedes Andrew's earlier book,
"Why I Left the Prophetic Movement". Whole sections of that
book have been included in this new one - because they are so
relevant to the topic.

ANDREW: We knew we needed to get this book out quickly, and
the fastest way to do so was to get some printed in Africa - where
I have been ministering for the last 2 weeks. (An amazing trip. We
saw literally hundreds of pastors publicly repent and commit
themselves to drive the Love of Money and the Prosperity gospel
out of the church. -More on this another time. God moved so
incredibly). I am due back in Nigeria in October.

So it is important to be aware that this first offering of the book
was printed in AFRICA. It is perfectly readable - but African
standards are not the same as the West. So you need to know
that this book looks like it was printed in Africa!! -It has quite a
unique "look" to it. So please regard any donation that you send
for this book as a donation towards our work in Africa. It is not a
donation for a perfect glossy product. You will be one of the first
people on the planet to own this book - but it has a "unique" look
to it. (We have only a certain number of these, so we need to
make a limit of one per person).  

HOW to GET THIS BOOK-

As always, we are making it available for *ANY* donation - or
even just the cost of postage (-which is only $2.65 to the USA).
We do not want anyone missing out just through lack of finances.
If you are able to send a "donation" that is great. But otherwise
just send the 'postage' amount. The best thing to do is simply
pray and send whatever God leads you to send.

TWO Simple STEPS:

First, please REPLY to this email so that we know that you
want this book.

Second, simply SEND YOUR DONATION to us.

-Probably the best way is to use PAYPAL to donate to us securely
online. Simply go to the following webpage to do that-

http://www.revivalschool.com/donate.html

OR you can simply send a check or money order (or cash) to
the following address (-Yes, U.S checks are fine):

Andrew Strom,
PO Box 21-904,
Henderson,
West Auckland 0650,
New Zealand.         

(-Please remember to include your ADDRESS.. Checks to be
simply made out to "Andrew Strom".. And we will get the book
off to you ASAP).

I look forward to your reply if you want this book, my friends.

God bless you all!

Andrew Strom.